The Indiependent caught up with Pale Waves frontwoman Heather Baron-Gracie ahead of their Friday evening set at Tramlines festival.
We discuss the band’s connection to the LGBTQ+ community in the wake of Pride Month, get Heather’s take on the Matty Healy/Taylor Swift relationship, as well as tease out details about new music following on from the release of the Manchester outfit’s third studio album, Unwanted, back in 2022.
READ MORE: Tramlines 2023: 5 Acts We’re Excited To See
You last played Sheffield in March 2022, wrapping up your ‘Who Am I?’ Tour. What did you make of this gig on a Sunday night in Sheffield, and what can fans expect from your Tramlines set?
I really liked it, the crowd was quite loud. We actually spontaneously decided to play ‘Noises’ that night which was totally on the spot.
I remember, you went off stage – was that to check you knew the words?
It was to check with our team they were able to do it, they were a bit like shit you’ve put us on the spot, we need to do all this technical shit! But we pulled it off somehow anyway.
What can Sheffield fans expect from your Tramlines set?
I’m expecting the Northern spirit, because I really feel that up here. It reminds me of home. And I’m expecting people to go for it – I love it when people let loose and just have a good time. I hate crowds that try to be too cool.
How do you go about curating the setlist for a festival where people might not be as familiar with the music?
I think we just try and play all the hits from the albums, all three of them. Just combine them into one setlist, nothing too slow. There’s nothing worse than playing a really slow sad song at a festival at like midday – it’s not what people want to hear I don’t think. They just want to get pissed and have a good time.
You released Unwanted in 2022, which goes pretty hard on the noughties nostalgia. What trends would you like to see make a comeback?
That’s a good question. I love some of the fashion back then. We were really playing off the 2000s era, the baggy pants, the DC skate shoes. I bought a pair of those last year when I stepped in dogshit and it ruined them. I have this joke in my band that like I just always step in dogshit, it is terrible. It’s awful. And everyone just takes the piss out of me.
Maybe it’s a good omen. What can Pale Waves fans expect in 2023, any new music?
Hopefully, yes, we aim to record a new album in the next few months. We’ve got about like 12 songs so far, but we’ve got a while to go yet with the process but we’re trying out producers this week. And hopefully we’ll aim for a single at least from the album.
That’s exciting! Can you tell us a little about your songwriting process
It varies honestly, it can either be me by myself. Or it can be me and Ciara, or me and Hugo now which is a new thing. Or some people that I’ve written with in the past that are on the second and third album. It’s just whatever inspires any of us, and we just run with that.
You said you’re feeling out producers at the moment. The music video for ‘Television Romance’ was directed by Matty Healy (of The 1975 fame), and he also helped with production on your debut. You’ve also covered Taylor Swift’s ’22’. What do you make of the Matty/Taylor Swift whirlwind romance/breakup saga?
They are just two ultra amazing musicians. I just wonder, did they just talk about music all the time? Imagine the songs that them two they could write together.
Was it a showmance, PR or genuine?
No, actually it was genuine.
Is that insider intel?
Well, I can’t give too much away. But I think they were definitely giving it a try, I’m sure.
Back to your own writing then – what’s your favourite song you’ve written and why?
It’s tough because I feel like it changes every single day. But I really am proud of ‘The Hard Way’ because the message behind it is very powerful and moving and can influence other people to be kinder overall. Be careful with your words; I think people can be so casual with what they say to each other nowadays, that even though people might not show it, it does affect them. Everyone’s fragile.
It’s July, the month after Pride Month. Obviously you’re a gay woman in music, and then Ciara is trans, and you’ve spoken openly before about being a voice for the LGBTQ+ community. To what extent do you see the band as a queer act, per se? Or is your sexuality or gender identity separate entirely from the music?
I think it’s both for me, definitely. Not either one. But I do hope to be a voice for the community, because it’s so important to us. And I feel like there’s really not much of it and it’s needed, it’s necessary. So I think I want it to be like part of the community.
Has it been reflected in your shows since you started being more vocal?
Yeah 100% definitely, sometimes I walk out and I’m like wow it’s like Gay Pride. Then you see a random 50 year old bald man in the back and you just think, who are you here for?
Do you see any parallels to someone like Yungblud – we’re in Sheffield and he is obviously a local lad, from Doncaster.
Definitely, there’s a crossover there. I love Dom, I think he’s great – a proper character, such a northern soul. Very soft at the heart. The boy has so much energy I don’t know how he keeps it up.
Ciara especially has been open about the negative impact alcohol has had on them. How endemic is this issue across the industry?
I feel like it’s so easy to get carried away with alcohol or drugs in the music industry because it’s just there. Sometimes you don’t have anything else to do, to be honest, and it takes a lot of power, and a lot of courage to say, no, I’m not going to behave this way anymore, or I’m going to really cut that out of this routine that I have. I see it all the time with musicians. But many people have, you know, come the other way and gone totally sober or really cut down. We’re definitely not as bad as we used to be. I’m totally sober now and I have been for over a year. Charlie will just always have a good time. He loves his Prosecco, he is a Prosecco Queen.
What about Hugo?
Hugo’s not much of a drinker. They’ll have a few glasses but then they’ll stop. To be honest, Hugo and Charlie don’t drink as much as they used to. And Charlie is a good drunk – he’s not annoying or aggressive, he’s just funny.
What would you say to upcoming bands in terms of advice on dealing with those pressures?
I think at the start, you know, we were just having a good time. And I don’t regret any of that process. Because we were young and having fun and on tour, and it was all so exciting for us. It still is, but we were so new to that world. I think the advice would be just be aware, try and be aware of it.
I know the band had a tour bus accident in 2020 on their way to support Halsey, although you weren’t on board at the time… how has this incident affected your attitude to touring?
It was awful. And they’ve all come such a long way from that. I’m surprised they’re even carrying on with music, to be honest. I’m shocked that they even can get on a bus and be fine with it. But they’ve said the music become comes over anything and they’ve really tried to heal from that process, but it’s still present. It’s such a traumatic thing to go through.
100%. In terms of your own music taste, who would you like to give a shout-out to?
Morgan Saint is releasing an album, and also her girlfriend Carley Ridersleeve. Together they’re working on each other’s albums, they’ve been working on it for a few years now and I just know it’s going to be amazing. They’re friends of ours and they’re just genuinely lovely people. And they look like they’re about to walk down the fashion runway every time you see them, they look absolutely phenomenal.
Interview conducted by Beth Kirkbride
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